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Post by kgooglog on Apr 14, 2009 7:48:34 GMT -5
Due to Toronto's win over Philly, and New York's loss to Miami, the Knicks are sitting in the 8th slot of the 2009 Draft. We cannot beat the Nets under any circumstances on Wednesday to jeopardize this. My line-up versus NJ;
Center: Sare Sene
PF: Courtney Sims
SF: Jared Jeffries
SG: Joe Crawford (the ref, not the player)
PG: Nate Archibald (sign him for the last game)
I'll even cut total slack to Mike D if he chats with Vince Carter during the fourth quarter, when Carter erupts for 101 points and breaks Wilt's record against the aforementioned starting line-up.
Speaking of centers, Hasheem Thabeet was at the Knicks/Heat game, according to NY Newsday, which is owned by Time Warner and Dolan.
Hasheem was trying to text message Larry Hughes on how to defend Wade, but Larry was too busy texting LeBron's non-existent wife about her "husband's" dancing skills and never saw fit to even respond to the 7'3 UConn pivotman's suggestions.
I liked Larry Hughes for about 6 games this year. Now, I know why the Bulls never played him.
FWIW, Q-Rich says that Wade should be the MVP this year. I say that Q should be the Knicks 4 by 4 SUV this year, and that Eddy Curry can be the Good Year Blimp of the Year.
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Post by axios on Apr 14, 2009 9:44:49 GMT -5
i think if we get the 8th pick, Stern will throw us a bone and give us Blake or Rubio. does he really want those 2 guys going to sac town or golden state or okc ? 3 teams which might not be around in a few years. the NBA needs the Knicks to be good again.
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Post by kgooglog on Apr 14, 2009 11:19:20 GMT -5
i think if we get the 8th pick, Stern will throw us a bone and give us Blake or Rubio. does he really want those 2 guys going to sac town or golden state or okc ? 3 teams which might not be around in a few years. the NBA needs the Knicks to be good again. Damn right, Ax. $tern needs New York to get Blake Griffin, as does the NBA. I know that the economy has hit all NBA teams, but the fact that new franchises as well as older NBA organizations, are unable to support themselves, frankly is not our Knicks' fault. The teams you listed, as well as several other NBA teams, have also diluted the talent base. If you cannot play with the big boys, than let's have an NBA dispersal draft and make the NBA a truly competitive league. If the NBA would stop bailing out teams like the Kings, Grizzlies, or Raptors, it would be better for all pro hoops fans, to be honest. Let Free Enterprise reign. |
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Post by axios on Apr 14, 2009 11:33:08 GMT -5
I agree, do we really need an NBA team in OKC, Charlotte, Sac, New Orlean's? That would be 10-12-quality players added to the remaining teams. This league is so diluted.
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Post by kgooglog on Apr 14, 2009 12:05:21 GMT -5
I agree, do we really need an NBA team in OKC, Charlotte, Sac, New Orlean's? That would be 10-12-quality players added to the remaining teams. This league is so diluted. This is what gets me. A team has already failed in Charlotte, and now there is yet another new franchise there. Oklahoma? Please. The Kings have had a longer history than these newer organizations, but probably cannot even afford to pay their first round pick. Sacramento has already borrowed money from the NBA to remain in the league! Ax, I think you and I on the same page when it comes to ridding the NBA of teams that cannot afford to be competitive. Ironically, the salary cap has been the Knicks stumbling block for over 10 years. So, the fans and management finally see the end of the tunnel with regards to bringing in the talent we need, and then the new CBA meetings come up in December of 2010. As a fan, we need to hope that $tern and owners do away with the player option contract and I would raise the cap, not lower it. Why do teams like the Knicks, Bulls, Lakers, Celtics, and others, have to pay for the stupidity of franchises that do not even hire the right people for the job? Why Ed Tapscott was even in the NBA after he was allowed to squander a 13th overall draft pick who refused to come to the team? Why are terrible coaches allowed to sit on the bench, after tanking the season for draft picks? It is inexplicable, IMO, that poorly run organizations run to the NBA nipple and suck money, simply because they cannot run a deli stand, let alone an NBA franchise. Drop these teams, have a dispersal draft, eliminate the salary cap and asinine player contracts, and the NBA will return to its rightful place as the second most popular sport, next to baseball. $tern needs to look at other franchises that simply are run to profit the owner, like the ridiculous Clippers' organization. Sterling was never dedicated to putting an NBA product of the floor, and, IMHO, should be forced to sell a franchise that the Lakers get to beat up on 4 times a year. It isn't even fair to the Eastern Conference! |
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Post by irish2u2 on Apr 14, 2009 21:43:53 GMT -5
Ken
You do realize that from a purely financial perspective the Knicks might be the worst run organization in the NBA. ; )
Small market teams will struggle in good times and bad. Oklahoma City, and maybe it's the novelty, is playing to sold out crowds. Charlotte (the Hornets) failed because their owner just wasn't rich enough. ; )
Maybe 30 NBA teams dilutes the player pool but I believe the issue is much bigger. I think there is plenty of talent out there but the dynamics of developing that talent have changed. High school kids who show ability and promise are pampered and spoiled rather than coached and disciplined. They play in summer leagues where the emphasis isn't on fundamentals but on making splashy plays. High school coaches don't want to be too tough on a "star" player because they can transfer so easily. Players feel a sense of entitlement from a very early age.
We see so many players now with the physical talent to be solid NBA players and even better but they lack the skills and the mindset to succeed. It's not their fault. A kid will get away with whatever they can. The basketball establishment has fallen on it's face and as a result we see a lot of young players who should be NBA players but they don't make it. When we see players like LeBron, Dwight Howard, DWade, Kobe, Duncan and Chris Paul who know the game is a demanding taskmaster and pay the price we lionize them. It wasn't that long ago that every player had that same level of commitment.
The NBA is not the place to learn basketball. The time to learn basketball is in high school and college. Once you get to the NBA you refine your game. You refine your body to meet the challenges. If you have to learn how to handle the ball or shoot a jump shot it's like a student who flunked Basic Mathematics taking Advanced Calculus. Failure is the only option.
We make a big deal out of players shooting jumpers off the dribble which is still one of the hardest shots to stop when done right. Almost every good player who wasn't a center/post player could shoot off the dribble back in the day. Now it's a lost art. ; ) Boxing out on rebounds, defensive fundamentals, passing, dribbling, footwork, shooting, etc. were all part of the curriculum back in the day. Now they feel like Graduate Courses. ; )
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Post by irish2u2 on Apr 14, 2009 21:47:35 GMT -5
BTW, I'm all for playing the young guys big minutes. I'd run a rotation of Sene, Hunter, Sims, Chandler, Crawford, Jefferies, Duhon, Nate and Wilcox and give Lee, Q, Hughes, and Harrington the night off.
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Post by irish2u2 on Apr 14, 2009 21:49:33 GMT -5
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Post by jbnewyork162 on Apr 14, 2009 22:21:20 GMT -5
I can see it now if we win the lotto get Griffin and then get Lebron the next year. every sportwriter not in NY will be whining and crying their tails off.
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Post by irish2u2 on Apr 14, 2009 23:42:34 GMT -5
I can see it now if we win the lotto get Griffin and then get Lebron the next year. every sportwriter not in NY will be whining and crying their tails off. Yea. Wouldn't that be beautiful?  |
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Post by kgooglog on Apr 15, 2009 6:28:06 GMT -5
Ken You do realize that from a purely financial perspective the Knicks might be the worst run organization in the NBA. ; ) Small market teams will struggle in good times and bad. Oklahoma City, and maybe it's the novelty, is playing to sold out crowds. Charlotte (the Hornets) failed because their owner just wasn't rich enough. ; ) Maybe 30 NBA teams dilutes the player pool but I believe the issue is much bigger. I think there is plenty of talent out there but the dynamics of developing that talent have changed. High school kids who show ability and promise are pampered and spoiled rather than coached and disciplined. They play in summer leagues where the emphasis isn't on fundamentals but on making splashy plays. High school coaches don't want to be too tough on a "star" player because they can transfer so easily. Players feel a sense of entitlement from a very early age. We see so many players now with the physical talent to be solid NBA players and even better but they lack the skills and the mindset to succeed. It's not their fault. A kid will get away with whatever they can. The basketball establishment has fallen on it's face and as a result we see a lot of young players who should be NBA players but they don't make it. When we see players like LeBron, Dwight Howard, DWade, Kobe, Duncan and Chris Paul who know the game is a demanding taskmaster and pay the price we lionize them. It wasn't that long ago that every player had that same level of commitment. The NBA is not the place to learn basketball. The time to learn basketball is in high school and college. Once you get to the NBA you refine your game. You refine your body to meet the challenges. If you have to learn how to handle the ball or shoot a jump shot it's like a student who flunked Basic Mathematics taking Advanced Calculus. Failure is the only option. We make a big deal out of players shooting jumpers off the dribble which is still one of the hardest shots to stop when done right. Almost every good player who wasn't a center/post player could shoot off the dribble back in the day. Now it's a lost art. ; ) Boxing out on rebounds, defensive fundamentals, passing, dribbling, footwork, shooting, etc. were all part of the curriculum back in the day. Now they feel like Graduate Courses. ; ) Bill... I hope that the Knicks will no longer be the worst run franchise in NBA history now that Donnie Walsh is on board. For too long, the fans have had to suffer through the fiscal ineptitude of the team's management, from the owner and his horrific GMs. I am even delusional enough to believe that Walsh doesn't have to discuss all player personnel issues with Dolan, like his predecessors may have. While I do agree that all teams have suffered losses due to economic hardships, I still think that small market teams who cannot afford a professional sporting franchise, need to get out of the business. If we look at the existing 30 NBA teams and pick out the ones that have tapped into the NBA's Stimulus package, I wonder how many teams would still be able to keep their doors open? My belief is that the Knicks, as well as the larger market teams, have had to pay the toll via the luxury tax and the salary cap. In the Knicks' case, the fans have had to suffer 15 years of keeping the fat, overpaid, and lazy players on a payroll, players who our GMs chose to reward for a season or two of adequate NBA basketball with their former teams. Of course, that is New York's fault, but, at the same time, why penalize the fans and yourselves by not allowing the organization to void or buy-out contracts of players who are not producing for whatever reason? If $tern has established a complex Stimulus Plan for NBA teams to borrow from, than the next CBA better terminate what I consider to be the bane of the game, Player Option deals. Players currently receive 57% of all NBA revenue, which is ridiculous when you consider who constitutes the 450 guys who occupy an NBA roster. There may be an adequate talent base, but there is not that basis of responsibility to the team. And you're right. It starts in 7th grade with the coddling of immature kids by coaches as well as parents, the greed of agents, and ultimately the greed of the NBA franchises who hand over the farm to these players. I suppose that in an era where Wall Street executives can renovate their bathrooms for a million bucks, that the NBA "disease" simply is a symptom of the times we are living in. I suppose I am stuck in the dark ages, when players like Jerome James, Clarence Weatherspoon, and Eddy Curry, wouldn't have made an NBA roster in light of their antics. And it wasn't that long ago, when a player had to play in order to reap what is now considered a minimum wage for entry-level positions in many non-sports related positions. Then again, the sport has allowed this to happen and continues to do so. Thankfully, there are those select players who play their asses off every night and actually "earn" their bacon. Too bad that too many of their colleagues don't follow suit and take the easy way out, IMHO. |
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Post by ironman95 on Apr 15, 2009 9:46:17 GMT -5
Cole Aldrich and Ebanks are returning to school, so cross them off the list. I still want Tyreke Evans @ 8, but Ty Lawson will be fine also. I want another pick to take a big man, hopefully Jerome Jordan @ 20-28. I do not want Stephon Curry, Jeff Teague or Brandon Jennings. The rest I am on the fence. That is my view of the draft, realistically, right now. I am still not sold on Thabeet, Calhoun yesterday stated that Thabeet is a difference maker on defense right now in the NBA, but his offensive game needs a lot of work.
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Post by neilverson on Apr 15, 2009 11:03:22 GMT -5
I agree with fleeing the Ty Lawson love affair. Now that Flynn has declared and signed an agent, I would push him if PG is who we're targeting and Rubio is unavailable. I heard press that Jennings wasn't having such a great season overseas. I think Flynn is a better floor general than Lawson, a slightly better defender and passer and he's almost 3 years younger.
Neilverson
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Post by axios on Apr 15, 2009 11:23:07 GMT -5
What to do, what to do. I'll just hope we get Griffin or rubio. If not- who do we take? Im thinking Evans, Derozen. flynn at 8? man that's high.
Im starting to envy the Nets nucleus. Lopez, Harris, and they'll take Blair. Not a bad little core there.
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Post by greatgates on Apr 15, 2009 11:42:08 GMT -5
Ken You do realize that from a purely financial perspective the Knicks might be the worst run organization in the NBA. ; ) Small market teams will struggle in good times and bad. Oklahoma City, and maybe it's the novelty, is playing to sold out crowds. Charlotte (the Hornets) failed because their owner just wasn't rich enough. ; ) Maybe 30 NBA teams dilutes the player pool but I believe the issue is much bigger. I think there is plenty of talent out there but the dynamics of developing that talent have changed. High school kids who show ability and promise are pampered and spoiled rather than coached and disciplined. They play in summer leagues where the emphasis isn't on fundamentals but on making splashy plays. High school coaches don't want to be too tough on a "star" player because they can transfer so easily. Players feel a sense of entitlement from a very early age. We see so many players now with the physical talent to be solid NBA players and even better but they lack the skills and the mindset to succeed. It's not their fault. A kid will get away with whatever they can. The basketball establishment has fallen on it's face and as a result we see a lot of young players who should be NBA players but they don't make it. When we see players like LeBron, Dwight Howard, DWade, Kobe, Duncan and Chris Paul who know the game is a demanding taskmaster and pay the price we lionize them. It wasn't that long ago that every player had that same level of commitment. The NBA is not the place to learn basketball. The time to learn basketball is in high school and college. Once you get to the NBA you refine your game. You refine your body to meet the challenges. If you have to learn how to handle the ball or shoot a jump shot it's like a student who flunked Basic Mathematics taking Advanced Calculus. Failure is the only option. We make a big deal out of players shooting jumpers off the dribble which is still one of the hardest shots to stop when done right. Almost every good player who wasn't a center/post player could shoot off the dribble back in the day. Now it's a lost art. ; ) Boxing out on rebounds, defensive fundamentals, passing, dribbling, footwork, shooting, etc. were all part of the curriculum back in the day. Now they feel like Graduate Courses. ; ) Ken You do realize that from a purely financial perspective the Knicks might be the worst run organization in the NBA. ; ) Small market teams will struggle in good times and bad. Oklahoma City, and maybe it's the novelty, is playing to sold out crowds. Charlotte (the Hornets) failed because their owner just wasn't rich enough. ; ) Maybe 30 NBA teams dilutes the player pool but I believe the issue is much bigger. I think there is plenty of talent out there but the dynamics of developing that talent have changed. High school kids who show ability and promise are pampered and spoiled rather than coached and disciplined. They play in summer leagues where the emphasis isn't on fundamentals but on making splashy plays. High school coaches don't want to be too tough on a "star" player because they can transfer so easily. Players feel a sense of entitlement from a very early age. We see so many players now with the physical talent to be solid NBA players and even better but they lack the skills and the mindset to succeed. It's not their fault. A kid will get away with whatever they can. The basketball establishment has fallen on it's face and as a result we see a lot of young players who should be NBA players but they don't make it. When we see players like LeBron, Dwight Howard, DWade, Kobe, Duncan and Chris Paul who know the game is a demanding taskmaster and pay the price we lionize them. It wasn't that long ago that every player had that same level of commitment. The NBA is not the place to learn basketball. The time to learn basketball is in high school and college. Once you get to the NBA you refine your game. You refine your body to meet the challenges. If you have to learn how to handle the ball or shoot a jump shot it's like a student who flunked Basic Mathematics taking Advanced Calculus. Failure is the only option. We make a big deal out of players shooting jumpers off the dribble which is still one of the hardest shots to stop when done right. Almost every good player who wasn't a center/post player could shoot off the dribble back in the day. Now it's a lost art. ; ) Boxing out on rebounds, defensive fundamentals, passing, dribbling, footwork, shooting, etc. were all part of the curriculum back in the day. Now they feel like Graduate Courses. ; ) "They play in summer leagues where the emphasis isn't on fundamentals but on making splashy plays" thank heavens for summer leagues, particularly AAU. At least good players get to play with other good players. And some high school coaches are just AWFUL , the last new idea they got was from Hank Iba. "We make a big deal out of players shooting jumpers off the dribble which is still one of the hardest shots to stop when done right. Almost every good player who wasn't a center/post player could shoot off the dribble back in the day. Now it's a lost art. ; ) Boxing out on rebounds, defensive fundamentals, passing, dribbling, footwork, shooting, etc. were all part of the curriculum back in the day. Now they feel like Graduate Courses. Excellent point. My son is always impressed when he watches old games (GS championship for example) and sees how players just pulled up and hit midrange jumpers. In my forties he'd come watch us old guys in rec leagues and say " you oldtimers are really slow but none of you miss open shots" However alot of the pros are getting much better at shooting then maybe 5-10 years ago. i think alot of them work much harder than we give them credit for. ( dangling participle)In PA it is difficult to transfer but high school coaches still aren't teaching much other than how to trap on defense |
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